dual action orbital or high speed buffer?

[CottyGee]

The Porter Cable 7336 is also a good orbital - according to this thread on Autopia.org, it is the same as the 7224, except the has a 6" counter weight instead of the 5" on the 7224 - and it's about 30% cheaper. Lowe's supposedly has the 7336 for $99.99.

[HEMMISSEY]

well, got it done finally.. No buffer. Did it all by my hand, "wax on... wax off" just like the Karate kid..

[Lik2race]

Originally Posted by 300cWannaB

well, got it done finally.. No buffer. Did it all by my hand, "wax on... wax off" just like the Karate kid..

Whoa !!!
Glad I had my shades available..Looks awesome,Great color too..lol

[turbomangt]

Working a finish by hand works fine as long as you don't have any serious paint correction to do. That is when a buffer is needed. Gary

[kcrnmale]

Gary,
I bought an orbital buffer from Sears and wanted to know your opinion? I don't detail cars for a living. Is there any serious drawbacks?

[dynodon]

The Porter Cable is a good machine, and the large random units like you can get at Sears are also good IF you use a machine at all.

I run a detailing supplies business, and have products that will work with a buffer, but I don't sell the buffers and don't recommend them.

Why?

Because:
1. The weight of the buffer negates any "reduction" in effort required to work on a car, I find that I am more tired after trying to buff with a machine than when doing it by hand.
2. Messing with the power cord and different pads is just a hastle.
3. Drop the buffer or let it get loose, and you have a dent or scratch, almost impossible to do that with a sponge or cloth.
4. Even low speed buffers will sling liquid product out in a wide path, and even in clinics by Meguiars they recommend you cover up your wipers and mirrors etc. If you do it by hand, you won't have spots all over everything to clean up after.
5. Buffers are only of any possible use if you have a product with some abrasive in it. I am a fan of very fine abrasive products, after all EVERY ring, mirror and lens is made with abrasives. That is what is required to keep ahead of the scratches that all finishes will get. But if you have a product without abrasives as in the finest waxes, then excess rubbing/buffing is just removing your wax and probably putting more scratches back in. If your wax is non-abrasive, then lightly buff by hand and leave it alone. No need to use a power buffer.
6. And this is a big one. NO power buffer can get into the small spots and ALL power buffers will put extra wear/tear on the creases, corners on your vehicle. LEading to excess wear and/or wear-through in the future. Even low speed random orbitals put much more pressure on a crease or corner than an educated arm with a sponge or cloth.

Some people do like buffers, and to them I say OK, but the vast majority of my customers agree that it is more trouble than it is worth. Nice profit center for the retailer, but not of much use in keeping a car looking nice.

Don
Illinois
Not a paid sponsor so I don't push my retail business on the forum. although I actually DO own a 300C, and appreciate this entire forum for helping me learn about my new car. I am glad to answer specific detailing questions anytime.

[turbomangt]

Dynodon, excellant overview on buffers. Please contact me on my web site I want to discuss what supplies you offer. I need some pads. KCRN, the sears orbital is the old version of the newer Porter cable. The post from Dynodon is right on, all I can add is this. I own five buffers, each of them has a specific purpose in my shop. The porter cable> great for applying polish/wax/sealant, big time saver on large vehicles. The Dual action cyclo buffer> great for tight spots with its two small 6" pads, heavy duty motor and a wide assortment of pads, will do minor paint correction, removal of swirls. The DeWalt 443 Da buffer> DeWalt came out with this machine to compete withthe porter cable. They installed a motor much heavier than the Porter cable so when you apply pressure it won't bog down. allowing for paint leveling. its motion similar to the Porter cable is safe and won't burn the paint. (This is my favorite machine in my shop) The high speed> only use it for serious paint defects, spot buffing, rarely use it on whole car. will burn quickly if not used with care, will remove some of the clear coat as well. Last the sears buffer > handed down to me from my dad, this one sits on the shelf. Gary

[HEMMISSEY]

Turbomangt, all the waxing is done, swirls are gone (thak god ), now the question is..
How to take off the dust that's falls on the car from driving and sitting?
I read somewhere that the dust wand thing makes swirls, so what do you consider?

[dynodon]

300cwannabe, If I may, I will let you know my thoughts on dusting cars.

Frankly, there is no way to dust a car and NOT put scratches in it, or at least in the wax. The "California" duster that is popular with a lot of people in my area does a pretty good job, but it has to touch the car to get the dust, even fresh dust, and ANYTHING that touches the car when it is dusty will scratch.

I use two methods and just assume I will get some very minor scratches that can be taken out by glaze or polish on the next detail:

1. I use a lambswool duster from Fuller Brush. Have had one for years. It is on a long dowel, with very fine and fuzzy lambswool on it. It is lighter weight than the California Duster and can be spun in your hands to clean it quiickly, and you can rinse it with water to clean it better. It probably will have the lightest touch to the surface of any duster I have ever seen.

I do not sell this product, but here is a link to the Fuller Brush site:

http://www.fullerdirect.com/products...10&ID=198&pg=2

Looks like they have a sale now for $15.99?

2. Quick detailer and a soft cloth. If you must get VERY light and fresh dust off a car at a cruise or car show (or fingerprints from those than can't keep hands off) then keep a bottle of quick detailer. Meguiars makes a good one. Spray lightly and wipe with a VERY light touch once to get most of the dust, then turn the cloth to a fresh side and buff lightly till dry/glossy.

Even washing with the best soap/detergent and softest mitt/cloth will put fine marks in the paint, that is why you need to regularly use a fine glaze or polish to get those marks that accumulate.

Don
illinois
300C Hemi Magnesium Pearl, just turned 1000 miles! Love it!

[dynodon]

Turbomangt,

I will contact you, but I don't have any buffing pads for power buffers I have a thick sponge that I buy at local stores, and give away with wax/glaze. I found a thick sponge is much better than a thin pad or cloth for applying wax or glaze. I use the one that is about almost 2" thick, and about 6" long. I cut them in half, to make them palm sized and give them away. They are the type of synthetic sponge that looks kind of like a real sponge with irregular pockets of air instead of the little consistent holes in something like the sponge that Meguiars sells. That pad it too thin to work for me.

A thicker sponge isn't so hard on the hand (flattening out your hand/palm for a long time is tireing. Also the thick sponge is kind of a gauge of how hard you are pressing. I, like many people will press too hard if I don't think about it, and I belive that too MUCH pressure is bad for waxing/polishing. So I tell my customers if they compress the sponge more than half-way, they are working too hard! Seems to work.

Meguiars sells some good stuff, and some not so good. They seem to have a good line of buffer pads. I also visit and buy personally, from Griots' Garage. He offers some good pads. He is overpriced, but finds lots of neat stuff. I guess you could say I (and you too?) are competitors of his, but his cost on ONE of his catalogs is more than my entire budget for the year. He probably doesn't even know I exist other than as a customer!

Don
300C