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running on 4 cylinders. HELP!

4K views 4 replies 2 participants last post by  Militant Khaine 
#1 ·
Hi guys. You are all probably sick of me by now. But I have a 300c 5.7. Never drove it. Put new block on and plugged the mds solenoid holes with core plugs. Eventually ran on all 8 cyl after keeping revs at 3000 for 30 secs. When i stopped revving, the oil light would come on the dash. Turned out the core plugs were blocking the little hole at the top of the mds solenoids hole and causing oil to be forced out of a gasket on the right bank (from front of the car) and caused smoke to emanate from the manifold. I got proper mds plugs and installed them. There was a bit of crap in the solenoid holes but i cleaned them out and hoovered them. Put it back together and used red gasket sealer on intake as well as ring gaskets (OEM) to ensure no leaking.

The oil light has gone out now from the dash and the oil pressure is good. There is no leak or burn oil smoke coming from the side of the engine but..............

............. The car is back to running on 4 cyl even keeping it revved for 30 secs. I had it at the top ecu / remapping / electrical diagnosing guy and he said it is not electrical. it is cylinders 1 4 6 7 that wont run. They are getting fuel, spark, and coils are all good. Compression is down to 120 on cyl 4 and 6 and the hose that runs from pcv to intake is sucking so hard that it has collapsed.

We also noticed a hose at the bottom of the car near the radiator collapses when the car is revved.

Silver06hemi has told me to take the rocker covers off and see whats going on and suspects the push rods are installed wrong but it doesnt make sense if it was running on all 8 cyl but had an oil circulation problem and all I have done is take the intake manifold off and install the correct mds plugs instead of core plugs and I have the mds cylinders not playing.

C'mon guys. Help me please. Im in UK
 
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#2 ·
yesterday I decided to take the rocker covers off and have a look at what the rocker arms were doing. They all turned in sequence and valve springs looked good but then four of them stopped working. 1 4 6 7. I guess this means only lifter problem or cam problem left. Auto elec checked whole car and reported it being mechanical and prob lifter related. Getting at the bolts on the side of the rocker cover where a PITA.

Eventually got the downpipe bolts off and pulled the right hand head (from from of car). Not as difficult as i thoight but time consuming.

Pulled head and even though i drained the coolant water still leaked out and was in the cylinders. Also The pushrods all fell out. Going to replace the mds lifters with non mds ones as i am using mds plugs now. I have to make up some 0.2mm brass sleaves to wrap around the bottom of the non mds lifters so that they fit into the mds retainers as i can get non mds retainers without the lifters.

Will there be any issues with a tight fit?

Does anyone know if it is possible to re install the push rods without a push rod retainer?

The head gasket is a steel one and it has just been installed. The car has not been driven, just idling for two hours total maximum. Can I re use it if i clean the two surfaces?
 
#3 ·
Silver06hemic told you to take the easiest route first and pull the valve covers to make sure your pushrods are seated correctly... After that then go deeper.

He also said to replace the core plugs with the correct MDS plugs to ensure no oiling issues however I suspected that the lifter collapse was not due to the wrong plugs being in there...which it wasn't.

Finally I also said to ensure you deactivate MDS using a Diablo tool to ensure the PCM isn't going nuts with it deleted but still being looked for. However necessary for eventual driving, I still feel at idle it should not make as much difference.

Did you do that yet?

Your head bolts are torque to yield so you should replace them after using them. Head gasket 'should' be ok... But... I'd replace they are cheap enough. Do not use any type of sealer or cleaner on them.

You should be able to source the retainers separately, I would not advise manipulating the existing ones.

My 2 cents is I have never... ever... Heard of 4 lifters collapsing at once or of a cam with damage that could cause this...

Have you pulled the timing cover, rolled it to TDC and checked the timing isn't off yet? I mentioned waaaay back that it might be worth it.

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk
 
#4 · (Edited)
Ah the savior again. Thanks pal.

Yes, in the previous post I state that i took the valve covers off and inspected the rocker arms and that the push rods are seated correctly. 100%. I wrote that they moved and then suddenly certain arms stopped moving. I am also getting a lock up like a flat battery whilst turning and then i turn again and it turns over well. I did also write that I installed the correct MDS plugs now. I eventually got them in the post after God knows how many weeks. pheeewwww!!!!

I really cant find any retainers separately. Honestly. Here in the UK, parts for this car are scarce, non existent or impossible and require machining or witchcraft to yield results.

I have looked at the timing and everything looks good. But remember that it did run perfectly for a few hours before I took out the core plugs and replaced them with mds plugs. This did solve the oil light on the dash at idle and the oil leak out of the right hand side (standing from from of car). The core plugs inserted to far down into the mds solenoid hole and blocked an oil way near the top. So the timing is right.

Have a look at this video:-



The comments on this video seem very much like mine and replacing the lifters fixed it.

I have not got a way to turn off MDS. I have been to what is left of the dealer, Chrysler breakers and Every top PCM programming / Remapping company and no one can turn off mds and its not available in all the options they have on their computers.

Im so sorry to say again. I have been over all the posts but I keep getting different info. unplugging mds and driving will not do. You need to turn off with a tuner. but then i read that if i unplug, the car will still run fine and on all 8 but with CEL and I have had it running on all 8 for a while with no solenoids.

My other concern is that i have made some sleeves to go into the mds retainer slots and it grips the lifter much better. But when i installed it i noticed that some lifters fell into the engine deeper than others. I thought the lifters expand and collapse but stay in place?? All the lifters were the same height and all good condition. I guess that makes sense because they are sitting against the cam and the cam will press against them and other times not as its turning but this would mean that the lifter would continuously smash against the plastic retainer and the force would snap the plastic??????

Here are some pictures so you can see. The gold circle things are the sleeves and they are the same height, depth of the retainers.

Will the lifters twist or will this be ok?

Will the cam push the lifter in place once it turns and continue normal operation once the lifter is seated at it most outward point (sitting flush with retainer)?

Lastly, Now the heads are off, all the valves are shut. When i re install them will the valves move to their right positions because of the position of the cam against the lifters and rods as nothing has been milled, replaced, etc?

Right now the engine is sitting in three parts and I am looking to re assemble with all in place but scared to do it in case lifters twist, cam goes pop and then i need a whole new engine.

Thanks peeps. ::frown::::frown::
 

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#5 ·
Well................. Re assembled the engine and turned over without the lock up it was giving me previouslyy. Running on all 8. But I have o2 sensor ecl and what i thought was an oil leak out the side of the engine leaking onto the manifold causing smoke is not................... It seems to be getting to hot and i get a god awefull ticking noise when it does this. I still cant drive it cos there is too much smoke and heat but the temp guage is three quarters. Starting new thread as running on 4 isnt the issue anymore.

Thanks those who replied.
 
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